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Author Topic: buddhist & Christians compatible? R flips compatible with QUdon buddhist states?  (Read 996 times)

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Offline 1r0n_m4n_xl

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Then you have zero to no idea about Christian and Vietnamese culture. The Vietnamese worship their ancestors while Christian does not allow to workship ancestors, many Vietnamese refuse to become Christian for that reason. Many Viet practice Catholic and also worship their ancestors they combine the two.

That is only one of the examples of conflicts between culture, religion, and identity.

The case of Korean were nomad people and had weak religious. That can explain the fast rate adoption of Christianity.

The Japanese have a strong Shinto religion that can explain low Christian adoption.

The Japanese still using Kanji based on Chinese characters, because Chinese was not a threat to their identity.

 Vietnamese abandoned Han-Viet to adopt Latin based because they have always wanted a separate identity.

English is treated as the second linguist in Vietnam even though there are not many English live in Vietnam because they don't see English as a threat but economic opportunities. This contrary to how French was perceived during Indo-China war.

here is my intake, Most Christian has no problem with Buddhists, in fact of all the non-Abrahamic religions around the world. I say Buddhists are the most tolerable here why.

1)Buddhism is more of a cultural philosophy/enlightenment & not a religion that deals with a God deity. ( my definition of Buddhism is atheist)

2)Buddhism's definition of worshipping ancestors isn't the same as the definition of Abrahamic worship of God.  ( Buddhist doesn't treat your great father as the creator of the universe)

3)budda's concept of God is that God is everywhere in the water, trees, animals. ( same kami beliefs like Japanese).

For Christians, Christians call it the '' holy spirit of God'' holy spirit can move the waters. holds everything on its place & it's everywhere.











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Offline Winner

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Again, that shows you have very limited knowledge of religions. I studied religions. Before I became Christianity adopted Son of God, I was Son of Heaven. Let me enlighten you.

Catholic Christianity believes in one god (god of all) and other gods and god's messengers. They don't worship ancestors.

Christianity Protestants only believe in ONE true god, there is no one else. They don't worship ancestors.

Buddhist believe in gods, but they worship not god. They worship god's messengers. For example, the Buddha lord was a human, a prince. He was not a god, to begin with. This is different from Jesus was a god descends from heaven.

The Shinto believes in Water God, Earth God, animal God ...etc.

See the difference here? The Chinese do not have a strong religion. They have a mix and confuse religions. Did you know the Chinese adoption of Christianity also like Korea at a fast rate despite the fact Christianity is a recent introduction to China? Christianity was introduced to Vietnam more than 3 hundred years ago through Spanish missionaries and still at a very low adoption rate. That is because the Vietnamese have a strong religious foundation.

If you think Chinese helped spreading Buddhism to Vietnam you are more wrong. Buddhism came from India and the most direct Indian influenced are the SEA countries such as Myanmar, Cambodia...etc Vietnam is close in contact with Indian culture than the Chinese.

For thousands of years Vietnam dynasties inherit religion from one to another, there was no interruption as in the case of Chinese where Mongol, then Manch invaded and ruled for hundred years and these nomads have weak religious cultures. That can explain the Chinese religious is a mix and confusion.
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Offline Winner

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Christianity Chinese according to BBC, the unofficial number is somewhere 400 millions from 1 million  30 years ago. The craziest adoption rate.

Vietnam since Christianity introduced in the 16th century which was 500 years ago now has under 10% combine of Catholic and Protestant. 

Meanwhile Buddhism Vietnam there are many big temples have been built. If the Chinese is a strong Buddhism country with 1.2 billion, the number of temples should be 10x Vietnam but that is not the case. This means China does not has strong religious culture foundation.

 the massive scale  temples that could only be achieved when a country has strong support from followers. Find me are there many Chinese temples surpassed this scale?


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When Vietnam becomes the center of the Confederated Buddhist States, we will allow all religions to practice freely.  However, we will not allow any religion to impose BS practices on non-practitioners. 

Offline Selurong

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Actually Christianity allows limited ancestor worship. We believe saved people in heaven can pray for us on earth that's why we also have Saints.

Also, even though pagans or others of different religion go to hell, they don't go to demonic hell of suffering rather, to Limbo, the place for righteous Pagans where Satan does not rule even though Limbo is part of hell. Limbo guards the entrance to hell and righteous people of other religions like Buddha, the Greek Philosophers and even Saladin lives there (According to Dante in his book "Infierno")

Hell has a place of Limbo and Heaven also has Purgatory, a place of cleansing suffering for souls with genuine repentance for sins yet need to suffer for their crimes for Justice' sake yet are eventually allowed entrance into heaven because of Christ's grace and their cooperation to it and desire to stop sinning.

Christianity was also influenced by Buddhism mind you and perhaps vice versa too.
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Offline 1r0n_m4n_xl

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Again, that shows you have very limited knowledge of religions. I studied religions. Before I became Christianity adopted Son of God, I was Son of Heaven. Let me enlighten you.

Catholic Christianity believes in one god (god of all) and other gods and god's messengers. They don't worship ancestors.

Christianity Protestants only believe in ONE true god, there is no one else. They don't worship ancestors.

Buddhist believe in gods, but they worship not god. They worship god's messengers. For example, the Buddha lord was a human, a prince. He was not a god, to begin with. This is different from Jesus was a god descends from heaven.

The Shinto believes in Water God, Earth God, animal God ...etc.

See the difference here? The Chinese do not have a strong religion. They have a mix and confuse religions. Did you know the Chinese adoption of Christianity also like Korea at a fast rate despite the fact Christianity is a recent introduction to China? Christianity was introduced to Vietnam more than 3 hundred years ago through Spanish missionaries and still at a very low adoption rate. That is because the Vietnamese have a strong religious foundation.

If you think Chinese helped spreading Buddhism to Vietnam you are more wrong. Buddhism came from India and the most direct Indian influenced are the SEA countries such as Myanmar, Cambodia...etc Vietnam is close in contact with Indian culture than the Chinese.

For thousands of years Vietnam dynasties inherit religion from one to another, there was no interruption as in the case of Chinese where Mongol, then Manch invaded and ruled for hundred years and these nomads have weak religious cultures. That can explain the Chinese religious is a mix and confusion.

I identify as a protestant Christian ''culturally''. I don't call myself Christian as you can see how my behavior manifests online. I have never been into any Buddhist temple or household, of course, my knowledge of Buddhism, Shintoism, Any Chinese religion is very limited & I consider it completely alien to me.

my understanding of ancestral worshipped is..  Buddhist shows offerings to their ancestors who they believe live in another realm. in return, their ancestors give them good advice and good fortune. Buddhists usually have altars in their house.  Buddhists usually believe that their ancestors can become like Gods.

_________

the Chinese

from my understanding only around  120 million Christians in China.
it's mostly Buddhism, Taoism, and Confucious I don't think Chinese believe in higher authority.

most of the missionaries from china usually came from America don't my understanding.

the Japanese rejected Christianity because most of the Japanese Christians were more loyal to the west. so the Japanese kicked them all out and became isolated.

as for Vietnamese history, I still need to observe more and study Vietnamese history.

thanks for your resposne, I actually enjoy your response.








 
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Offline 1r0n_m4n_xl

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When Vietnam becomes the center of the Confederated Buddhist States, we will allow all religions to practice freely.  However, we will not allow any religion to impose BS practices on non-practitioners.

Christianity is a sub-branch/direct off-shoot of Judaism. Judaism sacrifices animals, food, valuable items to their God.  Buddhist sacrifice money, food to their ancestors in the hope that their ancestors will look out for them.

Abrahamic religion also believes in the spirit of our ancestors or believe in human souls. in fact, most Catholics admire saints that will pray for them. 


 
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Offline Selurong

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Christianity is a sub-branch/direct off-shoot of Judaism. Judaism sacrifices animals, food, valuable items to their God.  Buddhist sacrifice money, food to their ancestors in the hope that their ancestors will look out for them.

Abrahamic religion also believes in the spirit of our ancestors or believe in human souls. in fact, most Catholics admire saints that will pray for them. 


 
Christianity is a sub-branch/direct off-shoot of Judaism. Judaism sacrifices animals, food, valuable items to their God.  Buddhist sacrifice money, food to their ancestors in the hope that their ancestors will look out for them.

Abrahamic religion also believes in the spirit of our ancestors or believe in human souls. in fact, most Catholics admire saints that will pray for them. 


 

I may be Catholic but I admire the spirit and devotion of Protestant Pastors. Theyre very charismatic with speeches relating to the ordinary man which inspires while our Priests commonly just go read from a book or bore us and sometimes guilt trip us with his exegesis.
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Buddhism doesn't get involved in politics.  Christianity has always been a political institution than a religious one. 

Offline Winner

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I identify as a protestant Christian ''culturally''. I don't call myself Christian as you can see how my behavior manifests online. I have never been into any Buddhist temple or household, of course, my knowledge of Buddhism, Shintoism, Any Chinese religion is very limited & I consider it completely alien to me.

my understanding of ancestral worshipped is..  Buddhist shows offerings to their ancestors who they believe live in another realm. in return, their ancestors give them good advice and good fortune. Buddhists usually have altars in their house.  Buddhists usually believe that their ancestors can become like Gods.

_________

the Chinese

from my understanding only around  120 million Christians in China.
it's mostly Buddhism, Taoism, and Confucious I don't think Chinese believe in higher authority.

most of the missionaries from china usually came from America don't my understanding.

the Japanese rejected Christianity because most of the Japanese Christians were more loyal to the west. so the Japanese kicked them all out and became isolated.

as for Vietnamese history, I still need to observe more and study Vietnamese history.

thanks for your resposne, I actually enjoy your response.
 

That is not true. Japanese was the country more open to the West than both China and Vietnam. They welcomed Western influence during the Meiji period. Christianity is widely adopted in Japan because they already have a strong religious foundation.

Vietnam was a country strongly against the adoption of Christianity under Ming Mang but that does not stop Christianity spreading what slow down the adoption of Christianity in Vietnam is nothing other than Buddhism.

Just ask yourself, would you adopt another religion if your belief already in another?

Ask another question, would you adopt a religion if you have none?

That is really simple.

400 million is an unofficial number according to BBC. Heck 1 million to 120 million in 30 years already massive adoption rate already.


 
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Offline 1r0n_m4n_xl

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Buddhism doesn't get involved in politics.  Christianity has always been a political institution than a religious one.

because it's a lot deeper than what I described out to be. If I went into details this thread can go 20 pages.
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Offline 1r0n_m4n_xl

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That is not true. Japanese was the country more open to the West than both China and Vietnam. They welcomed Western influence during the Meiji period. Christianity is widely adopted in Japan because they already have a strong religious foundation.

Vietnam was a country strongly against the adoption of Christianity under Ming Mang but that does not stop Christianity spreading what slow down the adoption of Christianity in Vietnam is nothing other than Buddhism.

Just ask yourself, would you adopt another religion if your belief already in another?

Ask another question, would you adopt a religion if you have none?

That is really simple.

400 million is an unofficial number according to BBC. Heck 1 million to 120 million in 30 years already massive adoption rate already.


saying a religious foundation can every vague it's not like all religions are the same. so it's hard for me to say. I will just assume that you mean the Buddhist foundation that rejected Christianity.

And i will also assume that you're talking about Christian missionaries and not talking about spreading Christianity through colonization or by the sword.

Christianity, Judaism, Islam has been rejected by the middle Easterns, europeans and latin america at first but it spread anyway either by missionaries or conquest





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Offline Winner

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saying a religious foundation can every vague it's not like all religions are the same. so it's hard for me to say. I will just assume that you mean the Buddhist foundation that rejected Christianity.

And i will also assume that you're talking about Christian missionaries and not talking about spreading Christianity through colonization or by the sword.

Christianity, Judaism, Islam has been rejected by the middle Easterns, europeans and latin america at first but it spread anyway either by missionaries or conquest

The religious foundation I am talking about here is a country with a strong dominant religion be that Islam, Buddhist, Christian, shinto...etc. Chinese just don't simply have a strong religion but Vietnam do and that is Buddhism.

I already pointed out a few things about why the Chinese don't have a strong religion.
- The fast adoption rate of Christian followers.
- The population of 1.2 billion has fewer large temples than Vietnam which population only 90 million, this means there aren't a strong number of followers/supporters.

In the near future, I am sure the Christian followers in China will become the largest Christian country.

 Vietnam majority Christians are Roman Catholic, unlike China and Korea mostly are protestants/Baptists. Protestants/Baptists is a recent split from  Roman Catholic. U.S. has high percent Protestants/Baptists

Conquest or not conquest does not change much. Vietnam was colonized by French for a century, Christianity introduced to Vietnam 200 years before the French colonization and to this day the Christian followers less than 10% . Why the adoption rate is slow? Despite the fact, Vietnam was a French colony, despite the fact Christian was introduced in an early time 500 years ago, despite the fact, American came to contact Vietnam 10 years.

S.Korea only recently opened to the world and recently came contact with the American and the followers jumped to 30% population.

Look at the Thai, they have been pro-west since the 18th century and the Christians followers are 1.2%. You could guess why?
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Offline 1r0n_m4n_xl

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The religious foundation I am talking about here is a country with a strong dominant religion be that Islam, Buddhist, Christian, shinto...etc. Chinese just don't simply have a strong religion but Vietnam do and that is Buddhism.

I already pointed out a few things about why the Chinese don't have a strong religion.
- The fast adoption rate of Christian followers.
- The population of 1.2 billion has fewer large temples than Vietnam which population only 90 million, this means there aren't a strong number of followers/supporters.

In the near future, I am sure the Christian followers in China will become the largest Christian country.

 Vietnam majority Christians are Roman Catholic, unlike China and Korea mostly are protestants/Baptists. Protestants/Baptists is a recent split from  Roman Catholic. U.S. has high percent Protestants/Baptists

Conquest or not conquest does not change much. Vietnam was colonized by French for a century, Christianity introduced to Vietnam 200 years before the French colonization and to this day the Christian followers less than 10% . Why the adoption rate is slow? Despite the fact, Vietnam was a French colony, despite the fact Christian was introduced in an early time 500 years ago, despite the fact, American came to contact Vietnam 10 years.

S.Korea only recently opened to the world and recently came contact with the American and the followers jumped to 30% population.

Look at the Thai, they have been pro-west since the 18th century and the Christians followers are 1.2%. You could guess why?

you made your a strong point regarding Vietnamese Buddhist & religions foundation.. and also Thailand.

that's I am here to learn what exactly is Buddhism.

thanks for your effort. I look forward to understanding Vietnamese, Thailand, Cambodian, Laos, Myanmar and everyone in that region.

there is only 3 religions in the world that Abrahamic religions have not penetrated and that is Buddhist, hinduism and Japanese shinto.
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Offline 1r0n_m4n_xl

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Buddhism doesn't get involved in politics.  Christianity has always been a political institution than a religious one.

Christianity is involved in letting immigrants/refugees in expecting Muslims, communist Chinese to feel the mercy and love of Jesus Christ. that we are equal in the eyes of God.

Christianity is also involved in the conservatism of America.

but instead its the opposite, USa is becoming more extreme leftist with nationalism chinese, Muslims taking advantage of liberalism.

____________

it's the zionist atheist leftist jews fault for leading the way.


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Buddhists actually do involve in politics as they tend to feed the poorest of a society. I think state led Buddhism wil be beneficial for the Confederated Buddhist Republic.

Offline Selurong

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Buddhists actually do involve in politics as they tend to feed the poorest of a society. I think state led Buddhism wil be beneficial for the Confederated Buddhist Republic.

Buddhist monks invented some martial arts for Avalokitesvara's sake. There were even some Buddhist schools in Japan like Zen Buddhism who controlled communities and where Bhikkus became warlords. Buddhism like Christianity cannot be divorced from state affairs.
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Should Buddhist nationalism like in Myanmar against Islam be tolerated?

Buddhist monks invented some martial arts for Avalokitesvara's sake. There were even some Buddhist schools in Japan like Zen Buddhism who controlled communities and where Bhikkus became warlords. Buddhism like Christianity cannot be divorced from state affairs.

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Islam vs Buddhism.


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jesus didn't exist. bible jesus is total fiction at worst and composite at best

christianity religion created was by the greeks

even the early 4th century greeks weren't sure jesus existed.

emperor constantine had to assemble by force all the bishops across his empire to one place (nicaea) to order them to proselytize "his" version of christianity to the rest of the population. those bishops that refused were promptly executed.

that's how the word "con" originated, taken from the first 3 letters of the name constantine

edict of milan yr 313 legalized christianity
edict of thessalonica yr 380 made Nicene Christianity the state religion of the Roman Empire. practicing other religions including different versions of Christianity now punishable by death.

 
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